PD Reversal Proposal

[Sha-Le Unique]

I'm sick and tired of seeing various GM's post PD reversals without providing specific ratings to reverse and/or costs. This math isn't rocket science...anyone that got through high school math should be more than capable of figuring out PD reversals. Yes it's annoying to look up each player and see whether the player was a former 1st rounder or not but that's how the system works and y'all need to get with the program. Most of you have been here long enough that not knowing the reversal system is a bullshit excuse and only portrays laziness.

That being said, I propose that PD reversals should not get processed unless the GM successfully posts both correct ratings to reverse and correct cost of points. Posting the ratings to reverse should be common sense by now but clearly not everyone has been doing this so those reversals should not get processed until actual ratings are shown by the respective GM.

Chris and I bust our asses to make sure the banks and spending are all up to date and looking good. The least you all could do is post ratings and costs to make our job easier. I for one will ignore any post that doesn't include ratings. I can live with not posting points costs if it's a new GM but the longtime vets have no excuse to not have figured out the calculations by now.

[Deleted]

Easy Break

[Matt]

I propose the points shouldn't be taken from the bank until the actual reversal happens.

[CSCommish]

I dunno, I appreciate your passion, but it doesn't bother me. If anything, I would not post the points, let me do them because when people do genuinely make an effort, they sometimes make a mistake AND sometimes I see someone post a PD and then edit the post to add another, after you already posted points. To make your job easier, I wouldn't worry about reward points from reward or article camps. Let me do those since I'm actually processing them.

As for points, yes, it's somewhat annoying but I've gotten over it. I have to check the points anyway. I would say the penalty is that if something cost a lot more than they thought, oh well, I'm not going to reverse the reversal and give back points.

[CSCommish]

I'd rather take focus on taking another look at the reversal system. The change to allow +5 to any reversal after one reversal has been made per year is not working in my opinion --- I know we've only have done it just this season, but it can be abused.

I also want to consider a separate set of points for primary and secondary because an D to C reversal to fielding range is the same cost as a Fair to Average in Hits. I was thinking of doubling for primary reversals or alternate schedule.

E -> D = 2 points ... Poor -> Fair = 4 points
D -> C = 3 points ... Fair -> Aver = 6 points
C -> B = 4 points ... Aver -> Good = 8 points
B -> A = 5 points ... Good -> Bril = 10 points

Thoughts?

[Danny Glover]

Sounds like Shale needs to smoke

[RoyalsGM]

Chris and I have also discussed a proposal regarding reversals and he suggested I raise it here.

There are times when the same player has the same rating downgraded in the same season. If a GM waits until the end of the season, they can reverse both downgrades at the same time and only "pay" the reversal cost (2-5 points) for the second reversal. However, if a GM reverses a downgrade mid-season and it gets downgraded again more than 30 sim days later, the GM pays the full reversal cost the first time AND the second time. So, basically, if a GM is diligent about reversals, they get penalized 10-20 points versus the GM who waits until the end of season. Seems unfair to me.

I propose that if a GM reverses a downgrade mid-season and that same player receives the same downgrade later in the same season, the GM should only have to pay the reversal cost for the second reversal. If the feedback is generally positive in discussion here, I will put up a vote.

Edit - oops i went to reply and it made me edit haha...sorry its 5am. :-) - Big Mark

[Boston Red Sox]

Dec 14, 2017 22:12:47 GMT -5 @cubsgm said:

Easy Break

You just can't quit me for some strange reason.

[Boston Red Sox]

Dec 14, 2017 22:22:41 GMT -5 CSCommish said:

I dunno, I appreciate your passion, but it doesn't bother me. If anything, I would not post the points, let me do them because when people do genuinely make an effort, they sometimes make a mistake AND sometimes I see someone post a PD and then edit the post to add another, after you already posted points. To make your job easier, I wouldn't worry about reward points from reward or article camps. Let me do those since I'm actually processing them.

As for points, yes, it's somewhat annoying but I've gotten over it. I have to check the points anyway. I would say the penalty is that if something cost a lot more than they thought, oh well, I'm not going to reverse the reversal and give back points.

I understand Shale's frustration considering he's gotta do the math 15 times if he waits a week to catch up where as it only takes each individual person 1 simple math problem to do it as you go. I'd rather not do a 3rd grade math homework assignment either.

[Sha-Le Unique]

Dec 14, 2017 22:22:41 GMT -5 CSCommish said:

I dunno, I appreciate your passion, but it doesn't bother me. If anything, I would not post the points, let me do them because when people do genuinely make an effort, they sometimes make a mistake AND sometimes I see someone post a PD and then edit the post to add another, after you already posted points. To make your job easier, I wouldn't worry about reward points from reward or article camps. Let me do those since I'm actually processing them.

As for points, yes, it's somewhat annoying but I've gotten over it. I have to check the points anyway. I would say the penalty is that if something cost a lot more than they thought, oh well, I'm not going to reverse the reversal and give back points.

Aight if you think only you posting points for reward camps would be best, that's fine. I was only trying to help you out with that but you're right. People edit their posts and go about this shit in different ways so if you wanna do all that, it's fine with me.

[Sha-Le Unique]

Dec 14, 2017 22:37:38 GMT -5 Danny Glover said:

Sounds like Shale needs to smoke

Seeing Dougie continue to be very sloppy with his PD reversal posts just annoyed the hell outta me. I would've made the same post sober drunk or stoned. There's only so much patience I have with seeing gm's be lazy and make Chris and I do extra work and spend extra time that we shouldn't have to waste. It's not fair, but neither is life. Meh.

[Sha-Le Unique]

Dec 14, 2017 22:26:58 GMT -5 CSCommish said:

I'd rather take focus on taking another look at the reversal system. The change to allow +5 to any reversal after one reversal has been made per year is not working in my opinion --- I know we've only have done it just this season, but it can be abused.

I also want to consider a separate set of points for primary and secondary because an D to C reversal to fielding range is the same cost as a Fair to Average in Hits. I was thinking of doubling for primary reversals or alternate schedule.

E -> D = 2 points ... Poor -> Fair = 4 points
D -> C = 3 points ... Fair -> Aver = 6 points
C -> B = 4 points ... Aver -> Good = 8 points
B -> A = 5 points ... Good -> Bril = 10 points

Thoughts?

We could always make secondary reversals cheaper than they already are. They seem to rise and fall more often than general talent categories. I absolutely agree primary reversals should cost more than secondary reversals. They shouldn't cost the same and I've refrained from posting secondary reversals at times for that reason.

[Sha-Le Unique]

Dec 14, 2017 23:02:40 GMT -5 RoyalsGM said:

Chris and I have also discussed a proposal regarding reversals and he suggested I raise it here.

There are times when the same player has the same rating downgraded in the same season. If a GM waits until the end of the season, they can reverse both downgrades at the same time and only "pay" the reversal cost (2-5 points) for the second reversal. However, if a GM reverses a downgrade mid-season and it gets downgraded again more than 30 sim days later, the GM pays the full reversal cost the first time AND the second time. So, basically, if a GM is diligent about reversals, they get penalized 10-20 points versus the GM who waits until the end of season. Seems unfair to me.

I propose that if a GM reverses a downgrade mid-season and that same player receives the same downgrade later in the same season, the GM should only have to pay the reversal cost for the second reversal. If the feedback is generally positive in discussion here, I will put up a vote.

I like your suggestion. Makes sense. I reverse anything important immediately and I'm sure others have waited til the end of each season to do all their reversals, which can hurt the players but not the banks and that's not right.

[Sha-Le Unique]

Can we all agree though that if a specific talent rating isn't posted, nothing should happen? All these "reverse so and so" without explicitly stating which reversal to do is just absurd. If you don't state what exactly you want done, it shouldn't be done. It's that simple.

[bigmark]

Dec 14, 2017 23:02:40 GMT -5 RoyalsGM said:

Chris and I have also discussed a proposal regarding reversals and he suggested I raise it here.

There are times when the same player has the same rating downgraded in the same season. If a GM waits until the end of the season, they can reverse both downgrades at the same time and only "pay" the reversal cost (2-5 points) for the second reversal. However, if a GM reverses a downgrade mid-season and it gets downgraded again more than 30 sim days later, the GM pays the full reversal cost the first time AND the second time. So, basically, if a GM is diligent about reversals, they get penalized 10-20 points versus the GM who waits until the end of season. Seems unfair to me.

I propose that if a GM reverses a downgrade mid-season and that same player receives the same downgrade later in the same season, the GM should only have to pay the reversal cost for the second reversal. If the feedback is generally positive in discussion here, I will put up a vote.

that should only be to a certain age. A team with lots of points and lots of older vets can take advantage of this type of thing.

[bigmark]

I for one think weve already raised the cost on upgrades and reversals. I'd of the opinion of wait to see the affects. A lot of teams were getting low on pts until the holiday 200 pt bonanza.

[CSCommish]

Dec 14, 2017 23:02:40 GMT -5 RoyalsGM said:

Chris and I have also discussed a proposal regarding reversals and he suggested I raise it here.

There are times when the same player has the same rating downgraded in the same season. If a GM waits until the end of the season, they can reverse both downgrades at the same time and only "pay" the reversal cost (2-5 points) for the second reversal. However, if a GM reverses a downgrade mid-season and it gets downgraded again more than 30 sim days later, the GM pays the full reversal cost the first time AND the second time. So, basically, if a GM is diligent about reversals, they get penalized 10-20 points versus the GM who waits until the end of season. Seems unfair to me.

I propose that if a GM reverses a downgrade mid-season and that same player receives the same downgrade later in the same season, the GM should only have to pay the reversal cost for the second reversal. If the feedback is generally positive in discussion here, I will put up a vote.

Edit - oops i went to reply and it made me edit haha...sorry its 5am. :-) - Big Mark

Yea, that's why this season I clarified that the ratings that drop again after a reversal, within 30 days, is a freebie, and ALL OTHER RATINGS, it's 5. But then I realized that once you reverse a player once, say in April, any other hit in June, July, twice in September, etc. were all 5 points and I don't think I thought it through.

So I did keep you in mind, Dave, but I think I went all the way beyond.

In any case, I would like to clean up the reversal system once more (and for good) by the start of the 1980 season. Open to ideas.

[CSCommish]

Dec 15, 2017 0:54:59 GMT -5 Sha-Le Unique said:

Dec 14, 2017 22:22:41 GMT -5 CSCommish said:

I dunno, I appreciate your passion, but it doesn't bother me. If anything, I would not post the points, let me do them because when people do genuinely make an effort, they sometimes make a mistake AND sometimes I see someone post a PD and then edit the post to add another, after you already posted points. To make your job easier, I wouldn't worry about reward points from reward or article camps. Let me do those since I'm actually processing them.

As for points, yes, it's somewhat annoying but I've gotten over it. I have to check the points anyway. I would say the penalty is that if something cost a lot more than they thought, oh well, I'm not going to reverse the reversal and give back points.

Aight if you think only you posting points for reward camps would be best, that's fine. I was only trying to help you out with that but you're right. People edit their posts and go about this shit in different ways so if you wanna do all that, it's fine with me.

Yea, it'll be easier. Even if we have a perfect system, there will still be flaws.

And I already talked to dougie and break about the Fuller and Aker reversals since the actual rating was not posted.